Lady Scoundrels' discussion: The Sister Queens - Sophie Perinot

This time we discuss The Sister Queens by Sophie Perinot

Ana: Who loved this wretched book? Who?

Ram: Not me.

Blod: Yes fine fine! No I did not love the book I chose. *swears*

Ram: In Swedish? Gimme examples. Teachers skipped that part.

Blod: Satans helvete också!

Ana: You know, let’s stick to Queen’s English...

Ram: Why? This is more interesting than the book.

Ana: Should I write something in a fine Polish slang? Don’t tempt me.

Blod. yes please

Ram: Yes!

Ana: The Sister Queens - jaka cholerna szmira!

Blod: Lol, yes we obviously do not want to talk about the book. 

Ram: Ugh, no we don’t. And I haven’t DNFed it officially.

*Ana grits her teeth* It is supposed to be a historical fiction account told by two Middle Ages queens: Marguerite de Provence, the Queen of France and the wife of Louis IX (also known as Saint Louis,  a devout Catholic who expanded the scope of the Inquisition in France ) and her sister Eleanor de Provence, the Queen of England. 13th century. And what I get? A first person narration of two very modern ladies. They use modern French. They think like a 21st century woman would. Let me also add: a very shallow woman.

;P

Ram: A first person narration from alternating points of views. Their voices were indistinguishable.

Ana: : Here I agree completely. Sometimes I had to check several times which of the two sisters’ narration I was reading.

Blod: I got tired of the book and went on wikipedia and checked some stats instead, that was more interesting than the book. The book was all, ohhh sex, happy, orgasm, oh no my hubby does not love me *yawn*

Ram: Yeah. I’d rather have read the dry historical facts than this fictional account, although it’s not the worst possible. I would imagine.

Blod: I agree, it was not BAD, it was just....I did not care.

Ram: The quintessential MEH.

Ana: I would compare this book to a Barbie doll dressed up as a medieval princess or to one of the productions of  André Rieu who takes a popular classic tune, rapes it, makes it wear a whore’s clothes and pimps around, pretending it is still a classic, cheapening the whole experience.

Blod: applauds, well said

Ram: And not being offensive at all while doing it...

Blod *dead silence*

Ana: EVERYBODY agrees? Gasp!

Ram: ...Could not care less. And I’ll still end up finishing the book.

Blod: I read the end, still I did not care. I do want to read about these women, just not this book

Ram: It’s historical fiction. There are no such things as spoilers.

Blod: I had to see if it improved...it did not.

Ram: I was told, by the person whose review convinced me to put this on my tbr shelf, that the start is bad but that it gets better. It does get better, marginally.

Ana: I haven’t noticed. Really it gets better? I can’t believe it. 

Your least favourite character?

Ram: Of the two sisters? Marguerite.

Blod. Whiny Marguerite

Ana: What about our dear saintly king Louis?

Blod: Boring mama’s boy. And yes stupid religious ass. He was more fun when he smexed Marg up all the time.

Ram: I’m predisposed to hate all things religious, well, not quite. But he didn’t have a voice in the book.

Ana: I so hoped that Blanche de Castille would be a more pronounced character. NO such luck. She was one kick ass lady.

Ram: Marguerite was on her way getting there, to becoming the second dragon, but then she had the affair. And that’s as far as I’ve read.

Ana: LOL but but...it was a DNF? Don’t tell me I was the only one who got to the end.

Blod: I Dnf:ed, since it was my book I felt I could ;) I did not want the torture to continue. It was not true his fic. It was more lalala pretty princesses in lala land.

Ram: I’ve not DNFed. Officially. I’ll still read the end but I was... distracted while reading this. A lot. Pretty clouds outside. Should I send you pictures?

Ana: Yes please *cries*. I am horrible at not finishing a book.

Ana: Who would you recommend the book? ;p

Blod: For those who like the fluffier kind of historical fiction 

Ana: I would say a Middle Grade history geek, nothing more serious. Ram?

Ram: I would recommend an actual history books to people interested in the period and these people.

Ana: So nobody?

Ram: Maybe to someone who has to read every single book there exists about Eleanor.

Ana: And wants to laugh. A lot.

THE END

Lady Scoundrels': The Darkness that Comes Before by R.Scott Bakker

Aye we Scoundrel ladies be back!

And this time we discussed a fantasy book called The darkness that comes before by R.Scott Bakker.

First question, Ana, WHY?! Why this book?

Ana: Ehem, I warned you all, time and again, didn’t I? I linked the reviews posted on Goodreads, I told you it is a very different book, difficult, demanding. You said you wanted to give it a try and so you did.

Ram: I knew it would be a hate it or love it book, but the prologue was actually interesting. Then it just became such a mess of characters and points of views that I lost all perspective. I simply didn’t care anymore.

Ana: It is actually a pity you weren’t more...obstinate? Motivated? The novel is not that bad once you get past the first shock of excessive world building :).

Ram: I’ve read novels with excessive world building before and they weren’t as difficult to get into as this was. I’ve seen the book compared to G.R.R.Martin’s A Song of Ice and Fire but I read the first two books of that series and that had the decency of starting with a single family unit tying the narrators together. It’s only as the story progresses that their voices and storylines deviate from each other to give the bigger picture. Reading this was like being a drop into an ocean one minute and across the the world on a small island the next. Then maybe I’d be back in the deepest part of the world two minutes later, or on top of the Himalayas. Or jumping from one infodump to another.

Blod: I did like the blurb..ahem, sort of. So I blame myself. But I agree with everything Ram has to say. So I do not need to ;)

Ana: How very convenient, right B? (*snickers*)

Blod: Ok if I must. It was not that it was dreadfully boring, I did make it to half of it. But I was also confused already on page 1. And then omg then! 1000 different POVs, one million languages, states and blah blah blah. I grew bored, I never liked or hated anyone. Well ok 2 guys seemed interested. I just wanted out in the end.

Ram: I’m totally blaming the ebook btw. A paperback with easy flipping to character index would have helped. 

Blod. I agree, I only realised when I skimmed the end that there actually was in index *head desk* Not that it seemed to help in this case because I could keep the peeps straight, I just would never remember their long long names.

Ram: I was too busy puzzling over the pronunciation to care.

Ana: Why  didn’t you hate anyone? There were plenty of characters to hate. Some of them were really well-rounded and complex.

Blod: Who?

Ana: Achamian for the starters, Kelhus next.

Blod: Eh, Akka seemed nice, Kelhus I only saw in the beginning and then I kept wanting him to come back and he never did.

Ana: Akka seemed nice? Oh, maybe you didn’t get to that moment when he condemned his own favourite pupil to death? Or when he left Esmi behind knowing fully well what she would have to do to survive?

Blod. Well you did tell me peeps were evil so I just went with it. It was a cruel world, people are cruel then.

Ram: Ana makes it sound so interesting. Too bad I never fully learned who the characters were to CARE. 

Ana: LOL maybe I will make you to read this one again or at least try to do so. Borrow a copy from your library.

Ram: If I do, it’ll be an eternity project. 

Blod: I am not really into to reading it either, it was just too much, too boring. And not nearly evil enough as Ana promised. But then I did not read it all.

Ana: NOT EVIL ENOUGH? I really don’t understand what you need more. The protagonists in this book kill and manipulate people right left and centre. They do it not because they want to survive or anything, they do it because of ugly politics and religious belief. There is more than one nearly-rape scene, there are Others who can change shape and blend with other people seamlessly, even taking over their bodies. If it is not evil then I am really curious what books you find so.

Blod: That is fantasy ;) Sometimes I do not get myself either. Still not evil enough. But then I just finished a book today where the main character, a woman, raped a guy, killed her own son for not doing what she wanted and then cut his lover’s belly open and taking out the child....yup.

Ram: The level of evil depends on how it’s done as well as the heinous acts themselves. If it’s written poorly it’s not evil enough or as evil as it could be.

Ram: Ana, you wrote a review for this and mentioned the historical and philosophical references. Could you give me an example from within the first hundred pages or so because I utterly missed them?

Ana: Sure. Kelhus is a monk who, reaching the tell-tale age of 30 (the age of Jesus when he discovered his calling and started his public ministry) is going to look for his father, allegedly somebody far more powerful than an ordinary human being. I consider it one of clearer religious references. Also take into account the fact that one of main religions in the novel worships an INRI. Do you know where these letters come from? If you are a Christian you should (look at the inscription on almost every crucifix).

Ram: Oh, those. I noticed those but didn’t really think about them. Maybe I’m just not religious enough to appreciate this book? (INRI = Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Jews, would have remembered it in Finnish but there’s a disconnect in my mind with these things.)

Ana : Then there is that Holy War going on which resembles closely crusades.

Blod: Ugh, Christian religion is so boring, was it my subconscious that made me dislike the book?

Ram: I’m just used to thinking fantasy books making references to Christianity boring or too judgmental  I’m a pagan at heart (although I was baptised and had a confirmation). 

Blod: Same here, I do not like it when fantasy books go too Christian (even if I like Ram has gone through the same boring rituals:)

Ram: I’d rather read contemporary or historical books set in real world examining and questioning the real faith than a fictitious one based on it.

Ana: Bakker is questioning EVERYTHING - the figure of Jesus/Kelhus is so skewed that I am really surprised no group of Christian fundamentalists has ever condemned this book for such a blatant blasphemy. 

Ram: Have you read Holy Blood, Holy Grail?I have. If there are people writing those kind of books without needing to create a fantasy world as a crutch I don’t understand why couldn’t Bakker do that too.

Ana: I suppose he wanted to tell his version of the story. And if you dared to continue you would see Kelhus marrying TWO women actually :D one of them being a prostitute.

Blod: Well go Kelhus then *eye roll* Another thing, so few women in this book, except for our dear prostitute and a queen called a whore a lot.

Ana: ...and there was that Serwe but I suppose you didn’t read far enough to meet her. By the way I agree - too few good female characters to make me satisfied.

Ram: Kelhus seemed like an interesting character but he basically disappeared after the very beginning. I think Bakker tried to do too much too soon and it overwhelms anyone not taking copious of amount of notes. And Christian fundamentalists will protest against anything. 

Ana: Definitely true - the world is unfurled too fast and you must get used to new characters being introduced every page which can be a pain you know where. I bet not many Christian fundamentalists read books at all btw ;) especially fantasy books with  religious undercurrents.

Blod. Ha, burn! :)

Ana: So how would you describe shortly your reading experience? (*puppy eyes*)

Blod: Confusion leading to interest and ending in boredom.

Ram: Intriguement killed by the scope of things. Aka poor writing.

Ana: I read it till the end and Iiked it with some caveats of course. I am a weirdo but don’t shoot me, please.

Ram: You’re just too smart for us. And that doesn’t get you shot, ever.

Ana: I think it’s not the matter of my brain, just pure obstinacy but thanks.

Ram: Or you just couldn’t get out of the house because of the snow.

Ana: ;P

Happy Easter from the past. Tune in again next month. 

Lady Scoundrels' review Rivers of London - Ben Aaronovich

Lady Scoundrels are back, and on Friday :) Today we review:

Rivers of London by Ben Aaronovich

If you have to sum this novel up in no more than three words what would you say?

Ram: And don’t you dare to use “Harry” and “Potter.” (<- My contribution) i.e. Not Harry Potter.

Blod: Lol, I would never think it. This was nothing like that weird little kid

Ana: It was exactly like that weird little kid but slightly older and in a uniform ;p.

Blod: Behave ;)

Ana: Let me rephrase it: Little Adult Wizard. Satisfied?

Do you think it is a good idea to mix magic and contemporary technology/science?

Ram: Of course it is. I want to see authors trying to work out where the limits go. What was magic to people from a few centuries ago is technology for us, what’s magic to us...

Blod: Yes I do.

Ana: Magic is indeed like a more advanced technology. Just smarter ;p.

There are some Latin quotes in this novel and magicians’ spells are also spoken in that language. Did it disturb you? Why, in your opinion, literary magicians love Latin so much?

Blod: Nope, why would it?  But yes why use Latin. I mean come one, was there no magic before that?

Ana: It seems like Latin was magical per se whereas it is just another dead language. Why not Greek or Hebrew? It bothers me a bit and it makes me laugh sometimes too.

Ram: It didn’t bother me, but I sort of wish they didn’t use it either. I generally dislike all spells that are not spoken in the language that the characters use. I dislike all spells spoken out loud.

Rivers of London (the UK) vs Midnight Riot (the US)- why do you think  the US editor felt the need to change the original title?

Blod: Oh this bothered me, the US title is just so much more US. And the cover does not fit the feel at all.

Ana: Midnight Riot left me with one big ‘WTF’ in my head. It is rather condescending to think that the American readers can’t deal with the original title i.e. understand it properly.

Ram: I just think that when Americans start changing things they never change them for the better. 

Ana: Different not always means better, unfortunately.

Blod: Just think about when they tried to make a British show American, does not work

Who is your favourite character? What do you think of the dynamics between Peter, Lesley and Beverly?

Ram: I didn’t like the triangle set-up but I liked the characters individually. 

Blod: Yes what was up with the triangle that wasn’t a triangle. That felt a bit male. But anyway, I liked them all, but if I have to choose...Nightingale, I wanna know more

Ram: I fear the triangle will be picked up later again in the series, but I haven’t had time to find out. I’ve only read the first chapter of book two. Nightingale, I want to know more but not too much.

Ana: I skipped book two (bad Ana, I know, very very bad) and progressed to the third part but I don’t want to spoil anybody. I didn’t like Beverly, I tolerate Peter and I am fond of Lesley, especially after her little accident which made her...more interesting. The fact that the author didn’t jettison her after that appearance-changing accident is a huge advantage in my view.

Ram: I know...

Would you like to continue the series (there are two more books available and the third is being written)? Why/why not?

Blod: Oh ..must  I answer? Ok then, the answer is no. Sure it was good, just not good enough.

Ram: Yes I would and I am.

Ana: I understand ‘not good enough’ but I am curious and you know what curiosity makes me do...different strange things. So yes, I will read on. However I might skip the second part - I’ve already started the third :p

Which scenes unsettled you the most and why? 

Blod: Nothing unsettled me. Horrible really. But I have been watching the tv show Utopia, ‘nuff said.

Ram: Personally, I wasn’t disturbed but I noticed a couple of things I’d warn my friends about, things I’d put in my review for those who want to know to avoid. Like <spoiler>the baby incident and mutilated corpses.</spoiler>

Ana: I suppose the possession was the ugliest moment but no, it wasn’t ugly enough to make me uncomfortable. I’ve seen and read much worse. Babies...well, I am not a fan of them and the one in the book was just a prop, like that child from the Punch and Judy show. That’s why there are no specific warnings in my review.

Who would you recommend this book to and why?

Blod: I would recommend it, because it felt different, it was well written and there is just something about the Brits. To all UF fans who want more.

Ana: I would recommend it to Harry Dresden fans and people who like London because there’s plenty of London in this series.

Ram: To anyone who asks, really.

Ana: Look, she will be proposing soon ;p.

Note to discussioners: Don’t try to impose word limits. It won’t work.

Note to readers: Until we meet again.